The New York school system is considering a plan for rewarding student performance with cash. Do you think this is a good idea?
Sunday, January 27, 2008
Cash for Grades
The New York school system is considering a plan for rewarding student performance with cash. Do you think this is a good idea?
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54 comments:
It can either be really good or really bad. Really good in the sense that it can motivate kids to do better. Bad if the kids start cheating more and more just to do better. But then again, all modes of motivation can be seen as that.
I know one thing though, this would motivate me to do better. Just like the pies. (:
Kelly Zeller 2nd
It would certainly provide greater incentive to perform well in school, but it would also we difficult to keep this reward system fair. Some teachers are more difficult than others, making it unfair to those who have a harder teacher.
2 questions.
1. How would they get the money?
2. How would you keep it fair?
It would probably provide the motivation, but there are probably quite a lot bugs in the system that would hinder it too much to do the good that it is meant to do. Overall, it looks good on the outside, just not a good idea when you get actually look at it.
Absolutely not...Why should be have to pay people do make grades? That is ridiculous and pathetic. The grades themselves are "supposed" to be the incentives for kids to work...if they aren't working now, why would they start working for the cash? Like Kelly said, people would just keep finding ways to cheat. Psychology shows that these types of incentives rarely work. The more rewards and strings we attach to grading, the less effective the educational system will be.
Ideally, knowledge gained should be the reward. We attached grades to creating a "rating system" and an incentive for kids to work harder and therefore learn. But instead students are just trying to "get the grade" through cheating, shortcuts, or doing the bare minimum. So why would attaching a monetary "reward" to grades change any of that? It wouldn't.
Paying students for grades--especially schools paying them--is ridiculous.
Lauren said that the grades are supposed to be what's pushing these kids. Sad thing is, not all kids care about getting good grades because no one has ever really made a huge deal about them in their home. Some kids just see school as a way to gain enough knowledge to land that awesome dream job they have... others see it as expanding horizons and bettering themselves by trying their hardest to get the best grade they possibly could. My parents haven't ever been huge on "Get straight As or you're grounded" and I'm happy about that. They always supported me in whatever grades I got if they knew I tried my hardest. When I came home with low Cs, they knew something was up and they pushed me to raise them. I did.
Grades don't always motivate kids. Parents can't always motivate kids. There's no one sure-fire way to get kids rolling. It's a very individual basis.
/endtwocents
Can anyone say...Kids Cheating like crazy??
Kelly...that's my point. :) Grades were the first way to try to motivate kids to actually do the work...now we are going to attach monetary gains to grades. Like you said, people aren't willing to do the work for the grades as it is. Attaching a dollar amount to a grade is not going to make those kids work any harder.
We keep trying to give people "incentives" to learn. But incentives don't work. Eventually the motivation has to come from within. It's the only kind of motivation that lasts.
Its not that bad as far as being an idea. But I dont really see how this would work out right for all the different students. I also believe that students shuold be self motivated for the future and not by bribes. And all the lazy students, like Dmitriy said, will continue being lazy. I dont think they will step up and work harder or study any longer than they already did before. The only difference will be that the lazy kids that usually dont turn their work in, will start turning in other peoples work. Dont really think kids will get any smarter or better. Yeah, Its also unfair, its easier to do well in an advanced class than in an AP class. Yet we get the same amount of money? I dont think things like this would motivate me too much at all. Other incentives that motivate me are punishments. If i get a 0 for being tardy, im positive that ill never be tardy ever again. (Or like in calculus, if youre tardy- u lose ur drop grade, which encourages me to hold off from using the bathroom for 50 minutes) But giving me 5 bucks for being on time, i could pass up that 5 bucks- no big deal. I could pass up awards, but id rather not take in punishments.
Just to follow up on my previous statement....
I agree with Jordan that its a good idea as far as motivating the slackers to do well, but not all ideas turned out to be successful(read: communism). Personally, yea I'd like to be rewarded with money for every A I make, but as far as the reality of the situation (taking into account the typical behavior of teens these days), the negatives (cheating) would easily outweigh the positives (motivation to do well).
Although the incentive might improve performance in school, I'd say it's pretty lame that you have to pay kids in order for them to do well. I mean come on, non of us have been paid and we've managed. Also, I agree with everyone on here when they ask how it would be fair?
Too many problems would arise with this proposed plan.
1) Increased cheating.
2) Only come to school to get money not to learn. (Priorities)
3) Where is the money from?
I think a person should have individual motivition to learn otherwise there's a problem. Society can help the individual be motivated but motivated to learn!
I personally think it's a great idea, given the fact that the money may be an incentive for disadvantaged children to earn some sort of income and also gain knowledge (yes, they will learn for the most part). Although there will be some who try to cheat or bypass the system, the majority of kids will become smarter whether they like it or not. Even if the idea is a huge flop, it is always worth a try to encourage more effort in the academic arena from kids who don't always have the motivation or will to succeed.
I think that like everything...
It has it's pros and cons. Now, being that the government gives money to the school according to performance, this would be a productive incentive to motivate the students, ultimately raising scores as well as informed students. Then raises the question: "What values are we instilling in our future youth?"
Do we teach them money is a reason to do something?
while i agree that it is pathetic to have to pay kids to do well in school, if it gets people to actually do stuff at school, then im all for it. we do not live in an ideal society. things dont work the way we think they should. if you have to pay kids to stay in school then do it. also a few dollars may not seem like a huge incentive to us, but the program is aimed at impoverished areas where kids dont finish school and instead go and get jobs to help support their families. if these kids stay in school because of this then they have a means of escaping their current lifestyle
plus, even in areas not poverty stricken, like our school, kids would try to get grades in order to get the money. I would
The government does not have enough money to satisfy children by giving money for grade. This is a ridiculous and unfair idea, that will not go well at all. Teachers teach and grade differently and also giving money for grades sounds highly unlikely even though it would be nice to be rewarded for the hard work. Also cheating would be at an all-time high, since some D-students will decide cheating is the best way to get good grades in order to get money and same for any other type of student. Cheating would increase while learning would decrease possibly. The grades might be better, but will that really determine a student knowledge level?
Getting paid to do work is called a job. Part of the reason we have education is so that kids can grow up to become effective members of society who add to it, often through their occupation.
With this plan, the question would always be how high do we set the bar? An A in pre-cal for me takes lots of work, while for others it seems to "click." There is no fair basis on which to set the standards. Also, who is to insure that the money even goes into the hands of the students? And, why would we want to give students drug money in the first place? (hah.)Furthermore, I'm not fond of teaching our generation, and/or subsequent generations, that everything revolves around money. It is the job of parents to motivate their children to greater things, and, if the parents do not, or will not, ideally the teachers would supply some form of inspiration, as they are often better judges of the individual needs of a student.
Finally, I am not sure that taxpayers who send their children to private schools would be fond of paying thousands while public schoolers are getting money for free.
:)
I think that this idea has both positive and negative aspects. This system provides students with some incentive to do well in school and also allows them to focus on what is important while making money and not be sidetracked from school because of a need to make money and holding a job during the school year.
On the other hand, I don't really feel this is a necessity and I hope that many New York taxpayers agree. There are many more pertinent issues in education and many better ways to invest money than bribing students to perform well in what is, to many of them, their only major responsibility. And it's not like students are not rewarded for making good grades in high school as it is - there are scholarships, you get a break in insurance, and it opens the doors to many opportunities. Anyway, I do not disagree with the notion of rewarding students for making good grades; however, there are other ways to reward people than throwing money at them (like exemptions) and there are much more important matters compared to this one that require funding.
Looking at this from a different point of view… it’s almost a guarantee that high school students will go out and spend this money rather than saving it. So maybe we can ditch the tax rebates plan and just stick to this one to fix the economy.
I don't necessarily agree with paying students for good grades for a few reasons.
First off, if you get good grades, and get into college. Is that not when you "get money for grades?" They have academic scholarships for students that achieve academic success. So in a way, they are already "paying students for grades." The amount of money awarded to you through scholarships is fair because it directly resembles how hard you tried and how well you did.
Secondly, there is a quote in the article that says,
"But the idea is controversial. Many educators maintain, among other objections, that children have to learn for the love of it, not for cash."
Do people not learn more to get a better job? Most students understand that to get a higher paying job, you normally go to school and study a certain subject.
Students today do not generally love spending countless hours in a classroom. They enjoy the benefits they get from that classroom. Which is ultimately MONEY.
Sure offers of money will/can encourage students to do better, but also many problems can arise from the offer. Students could start cheating more often. The idea can be good or bad, whichever way you look at it.
You shush Lauren.
Who doesn't love money?!
But in all seriousness, school is for learning, not monetary means. Of course parents can give you money for good grades, but that's where it should begin and end.
Motivation is key. Sure being paid cash can motivate a student to always go to school. But school shouldn't be considered as a job with an hourly wage. If all schools used this method of motivation, the salaries of the students would jack up the state and city taxes. "There aint no free lunch." Instead, schools should provide another means of motivation such as... FREE EDUCATION. New York is a very expensive place to live. If financial problems exist that force you to need a school salary. Then move to a more affordable location. That's what my family had to do.
i would have to say that this idea has its pros and cons. a major opposition to this idea is that it only spoils our generation even more. we are already used to getting something, even a ribbon, whether we win or lose in a tournament, now its getting to the point where we reward for school. Basic education shoyuld be mandatory, incentives shouldnt have to be in place for us to do thigs, but this is how we were born: wanting something in return.
as far as a good reason for this paid education, i would have to say that it will pay the kids and actually make them smarter. if kids are getting paid for school, as opposed to before, they stasrt to appreciate the opportunity theyve been given.
don't shush me, kelly :-P
How are they going to pay for this? Will they lower the teachers' salary or raise taxes or what? Not only does this form of encouragement full of faults, it is rather implausible.
The mayor of New York City, the obscenely wealthy and disillusioned Michael Bloomberg, plans on funding this cheap, misguided experiment out of his own fat pocket.
Instead cheating the kids out of a real education through futile and transient gift offers, invest that money in training inspirational teachers to really motivate the kids into learning. Invest in laboratories, equipment, and facilities that the students want to utilize and explore their own interests. Let a student's own sense of accomplishment be a his incentive to work hard, not an ineffectual handout.
My father works for the New York City Board of Education. The reason this is being done surpasses what most of us here at Elkins High School can possibly understand. The average student does not pass basic classes in New York City. Inner city kids are not well off in the first place, and money is something many, MANY of them are looking for and need. As a couple of AP kids from suburbia, Texas, of course money for grades seems like a false rewards system, but for kids who have nothing else, it is a worthwhile endeavor.
Like communism, this is an idealist idea. It works well on paper but not in the real world. First, although as students we would all appreciate extra cash, the government would have to come up with a system to reward this money - meaning more red tape. Second, in order to be fair, a child who comes from a wealthy family and a child who comes from a poor family would have to receieve the same amount of money, thus undermining the actual point of paying student for good grades. Third, the kids who are receiveing the bad grades in the first place are often those who misbehave. Therefore, if you give them the ability to earn money, they will surely go to extreme lengths to get it - more cheating.
Truly, this idea is not practical at all.
This just depresses me. In a perfect world the only motivation necessary to fuel students would be the love of knowledge and the benefit of an education. It is sad how low society's appreciation of the educated individual has sunk. Undoubtedly, this strategy will motivate kids to achieve good grades, but at the same time it will erode their character.
Oh I will shush whoever I want!
Don't make me do the Z snap thing.
I agree with DJ in the sense that AP classes are absolutely tougher than the advanced ones which would cause a major complaint for the AP kids! I don't see why money would be necessary for student achievement? If they are motivated then they are working for the right reasons, but students who only finish homework just to get money definately are not the people who we want help run our country in the future...I would rather have the businessmen and employees who are devoted and passionate for their occupation and not just in it for the money..............i know there are many people who are there for the cash but it seems the government would be creating a larger population in that group by paying students to do school work.
chelbi jackson
I personally believe that for US Americans "Cash for grades" is an awful idea. Why you say? Well because by the time that this law is passed I will no longer be in our educational system.
I'm sure the idea sounds great to kids. Money is an effective motive to make the grades. As a soon-to-be graduate though, I must give my honest opinion to say that this idea is ludicrous. The true incentive is becoming smarter, getting into college, and getting a future job. Money should come after all the hard-work in school - through their job! Also, it would make me indignant to see an advanced student in English make even a buck higher than me because he gets an A in advanced and I get a B in AP. It's too hard to regulate this as every teacher is different.
i would love to be paid for grades, it would incourage me to do well and it would motivate me to actually want to listen in class because i would know that i would need it on a later date... and we all know that i am a gold digger who just wants the cash ;)
might as well pay kids to use the bathroom or some other function that should be accomplished with minor difficulty.
Arbitrariness may be defined as determining a principle by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle, and that is exactly what this notion may be categorized as. In our ends-based and goal-oriented society, incentive reigns as the sole elixir by which society's processes may be perpetuated. In other words, the selfish nature of humans inherently persuades them to seek out the most beneficial action over others or even inaction. However, when weighing whether or not to do an arduous task, such as education in the context which the New York government is forcing us to look at is as, pros and cons must come into play. This is what sets apart incentive from motivation. For example, I may choose to put hours of excercise into a workout program(an obvious hypothetical considering who's writing this) based on the incentive of attracting more women to my newly studified body, but it is only after weighing in the fact that the lost time in exercise will be reimbursed by a prolonged lifespan that I will find the motivation to pursue such an endeavor. Thus, I would be looking towards a lack of the punishment of sooner death more than the superfluous benefit of becoming attractive when deliberating. Likewise, when in school, I pursue many of my academic goals based merely on the fact that I fear what punishment would come if I did not, whether it be an immediate zero or even greater long term effects. Though the entire game of life may be based upon an undetermined goal so far, I reassure my unjustified actions by the knowledge that I avoided some sort of dire consequence. Syllogistically, then if I am given the opportunity to seek extra credit or some endeavor that has a lesser or nonexistent punishing consequence, I am much less likely to pursue it. Therefore, the thought that offering money to children in order to pursue their studies is entirely arbitrary because not only is there no intuitive link between academic work and some sort of monetary reward(whose origins are ambiguous at best and clearly undermine the already abysmal salary of teachers), but the probability of the students acting on such an incentive is unlikely due to the lack of motivation it provides.
I don't think it would be a very good idea because those students will grow up and only want to do something if they get rewarded for it. They might not ever be happy with just the satisfaction of a job well done.
This would certainly pose a great incentive for all the students. Yet, it would not be as effective as it seems because the students will resort to cheating.
The idea of rewarding with money is a little ridiculus. If you have to bribe kids to get them to everything you are not allowing them to develop a sense self-motivation.
Ummmm I would love some cash for school. Why would we be opposed to this
Paying students for getting good grades would be a great idea, not only will it make the students want to try harder to get good grades, but it will also help them handle money better. So paying students for getting good grades would be a fantastic idea.
I can understand why they'd do something like this for the area they're in. None of us would understand because we work for our grades anyways, so we see it as unfair and scoff at it. But for kids who have no motivation whatsoever to do well in school and who are poor to boot, why not pay them to get good grades? Seems like you can kill two birds with one stone - increase education AND help solve poverty issues. Maybe that's a little naive, but it seems like a good idea to me.
Heck, I'd love it. It could work out for things such as standardized tests. That's the only place I see this working, at least in the current Texas system. The watch-dog attitude that teachers are supposed to have when administering these tests should prevent the cheating problems. There isn't the problem of one test being randomly much harder than another test (as might happen with different teachers).
Now, as to the whole point of education: How about we look at it from an economics standpoint? Adam Smith promoted public education as a way to prevent people from being dull, and to help broaden their aptitude for whatever their specialization. Economically, the invisible hand is eventually going to push people to do what they're good at. Therefore, it does not ultimately matter what motivates their brains to expand, as long as it is done in time for them to catch their niche.
Basically as everyone else has stated, money for good grades is a great incentive, however it will spark a massive wave of cheating. The school seems to ignore the fact that some students are simply not good at school, thus money for grades will only make them cheat or drop out of school. Moreover, those students that already make good grades will actually be less motivated to keep up their grades due to the overjustification effect (a psychological term). Studies show that if one is rewarded for doing things that they are already good at, it motivaties them less to do that thing.
I think the idea of cash for grades is an interesting idea. I would love the extra cash, but I know people would definetly cheat.
It either can be good or bad. The good side is make people want to work more harder to get the money, or they will start try to study to get the money. The Bad side is hard to keep it fair because people will start cheating for the money.
i agree 110% with this, school is like a job we should be getting payed also
Rewarding students with cash seems like a good idea, but also has some drawbacks. By rewarding students with cash, students will try harder to get better grades and have a chance to gain knowlegde by earning a little extra cash. However, students will take advantage of this system by cheating.
It would be better if the teachers, administrators, etc. would have an after school program where they could actually see each student doing his/her own work. If the students are putting in an effort and they should be rewarded. Of course there'd be a different standard of measures for each specific class, depending on the level of work.
Sorry this is late I got home from my soccer game and my internet server was down so im typing this up from my friend's cell phone
I do not believe this to be a good idea as it stands now. It would be rediculous to think that no matter what level course you are enrolled in students could be awarded the same. Each course has many different levels offered to student, such as honors, AP, College Now, and the plain advanced classes. the question they ought to be asking, if the truly believe this idea to work, is how to simply standardize the awards. It unfair to those that put forth the extra effort by taking a more challenging course and is given a "B" than one who decides to take the easy way out and makes an "A".
Secondly I would like to knowe where the funds are coming from to supply this new concept, "Cash for Grades"
I mean dont get me wrong it definately is a strong incentive to strive towards educational greatness, which in turn will allow our economy to grow and ensure that the life of America is in safe educated hands.
i don't think anyone would really mind getting cash for grades but i don't think it's the right motivation for students.
I am not in favor of paying kids for making good grades. One should be able to motivate themselves without being payed. I understand that some kids need extra motivation so I guess some schools can try it out if they want. In order for this plan to work, there needs to be strict guidelines on the whole plan to make it fair to all students.
This idea is good in the sence that it will defenetly motivate people to actually go to school and do work but at the same time cheating can become a problem... Krystal C.
I definately agree with rewarding students with cash for good grades. I believe that it will help keep the students motivated throughout high school to perform well academically.
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